Following 2018 draftees

Discussion in 'Prospects' started by Ozymandias, Jul 25, 2017.

  1. SacTownKid

    SacTownKid Well-Known Member

    I think the Kings just traded or drafted some players that can produce points, in fact, that's probably the primary reason they made it to the NBA for some of them. I think the Kings have potentially two 20 point scorers out of Fox, Hield, Bogdan and Skal if used properly. The issue is what some of them don't do. I think Miles Bridges, bridges the gap in those areas. Sorry had to. And you mentioned all the players that will probably go higher than Bridges. I can see the argument for each, but I also see that they don't possess the same characteristics that comprise what Bridges is. At least not in totality. I'm not sure if it were me I would take Bridges over most of them, and I'd even throw Bamba in there, I think his ceiling is ridiculous and he can do things offensively that aren't being uncovered at the moment. I look forward to seeing what Bridges can do for his value because the Spartans are thinking net cutting or bust.
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  2. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Little late responding because of my daughter visiting. So, first, I don't see Bagley as a center. Doesn't mean he couldn't fill in there at times. If Dramond Green can play center at times, then I guess Bagley can. But I see his normal position as a PF. While I agree that his skill set needs some tuning in some areas, one can't ignore what he's been able to do with that skill set. When you consider his age, and how good he can become with hard work, he's very hard to pass up. He's an explosive leaper, and a quick second leaper. He has a motor that won't quit and a nose for the basketball. He's one of the best athlete's in the draft. Right now he's shooting 35% from the three for the season, but for the last five games, he's shooting 45.5% from the three. He's an aggressive player on both ends of the court. While he doesn't have the length of some of the others, he's certainly not a T-Rex. I've mentioned that I look for the Wow factor. I get 4 or 5 Wow's a game minimum from Bagley. I can't say that about any other player I've watched so far this year.

    Now having said all that, if you could guarantee me that I could trade the pick that would acquire Bagley and end up with Jaren Jackson and Mikal Bridges, I would leap at that. But in my humble opinion, that's a pipe dream that no one could guarantee. Make no mistake, I love both J. Jackson and M. Bridges, and if for some reason the Kings play well enough to end up picking in the 6 to 8 range, I would definitely have both those guys targeted.
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  3. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Anyone that saw the awards ceremony after the European championship game with Doncic standing there right next to Bogdanivic, he was at least two or three inches taller than Bogs. So I agree with you. I don't have any doubts about his height.
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  4. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Well now that I've had a chance to see many of the top players two or three times minimum, I've revised my top 15. I stopped at 15 because I've been concentrating mostly the top players, and haven't seen enough of the next tier to form an honest opinion. I might add, that my top 15 is influenced by my bias as a Kings fan. In other words, I'm taking the Kings needs into consideration with my ranking. Some other people might have them ranked differently.

    1. Luka Doncic: 6'8", PG,SG,SF. I've seen him play enough to believe that he may be the most skilled player in this draft class, and he's only 18 years old. He's a player that can step in and play multiple positions.
    2. Marvin Bagley: 6'11" PF/C. Freak athlete who can do a little bit of everything, is still a bit of a work in progress. Terrific motor, and great rebounder. Decent looking jumper. Tremendous upside.
    3. DeAndre Ayton: 7'1", C. Excellent athlete with great defensive potential. Great lateral quickness for a big man. Runs the floor well, and has shown 3 pt shooting range. Needs to work on post defense and offense.
    4. Michael Porter: 6'10", SF/PF. Not a freak athlete, but close. 2nd most skilled player in the draft. Can score from anywhere on the floor. Injury recovery will determine his draft status.
    5. Jaren Jackson: 6'11", PF. Not spectacular but very skilled offensive and defensive player. Listed with a 7'4" wingspan, he has natural shotblocking instincts along with a good looking 3 pt shot.
    6. Colin Sexton: 6'3", PG. May be the most fun player in college to watch. He never stops attacking. Lightning quick with great handles. Shot is a bit inconsistent, but with good form and a quick release.
    7. Mikal Bridges: 6'7", SF/SG. May be the best one on one defender in college. Good 3 pt shooter. Handles need work, but probably good enough for the SF position. Not sure about SG. Like him a lot.
    8. Mohamed Bamba: 7'0", C. Why so low? Well, he has zero post game, and I mean ZERO! Not sure about his hands. He fumbles passes and rebounds. Terrific shotblocker ( 7'9" wingspan) and can shoot the 3.
    9. Miles Bridges: 6'7", SF/PF. Had him higher to start year, but so far, I've seen little improvement from last year. I still like him, but want him to take his game up another notch. Still has good upside.
    10. Trae Young: 6'2", PG. He's averaging close to 29 pts, and 9 assists per game. Shooting around 38% from the three. Quick smart PG who has worked his way up to the number 2 spot for PG's in my opinion.
    11. Wendal Carter: 6'9", PF. Bagley's running mate at Duke. Smart, solid player that I predict will be close to a 20/10 guy in the NBA. Not spectacular, but a quiet blue collar player that gets the job done.
    12. Robert Williams: 6'9", PF. Freak athlete who is one of the best shotblockers in college. Good man defender as well, and a very good rebounder. He's limited offensively or would be higher. Still has offensive upside.
    13. Trevon Duval: 6'3", PG. Solid athlete with good playmaking and defensive abilities. Bad 3 pt shooter who is shooting around 15% from the three. Probably more mental now than anything else. Needs improvement.
    14. Lonnie Walker: 6'5", SG. Terrific shooter who can score from anywhere on the floor. I could see him going higher if a team is looking a good scoring wing. You can't have enough of them in today's NBA.
    15. Kevin Knox: 6'9", PF/SF. Not quite sure what Kevin is yet, other than inconsistent. Had him higher to start, and still like him. I think he's athletic enough to play the SF position, but needs to work on his shot.

    That's where I have them ranked as of today. Players that have moved up, and have been impressive have been Trae Young, and Mikal Bridges. I might add Jaren Jackson into that group for breaking into the top five, but since I had him at six or seven to start the season, it's not that big of a move. I think he'll take a little while to adjust to the NBA, but he has a lot of potential. Mikal Bridges is fun to watch play defense. He guards the ball all the way up the court, and commonly guards the other teams PG. He's shot the three at over 40% all year long (46.6%) which he did last year as well, so it's not an aberration. His handles need work, which is why I don't see him as a SG. He can make the basic pass, but he's not a playmaker, nor does he turn the ball over very much. Smart player who knows his limits. Young has been a pleasant surprise. Can't wait to watch him the rest of the year. If you haven't seen Sexton play, do yourself a favor and watch him. One of the most exciting players I've see in a while. If your looking for a wow factor, he'll give you several a game.

    I'm not as high on Bamba as some others, and I think their betting on his long range potential. But he's going to take some time offensively. Other than dunking the ball, he's downright terrible in the post. No footwork, or post moves to speak of. He does have a very nice three point shot though. I think he'll get minutes on the floor as a rookie strictly for his defensive abilities, but don't expect too much out of him offensively for a while. If Robert Williams can ever develop a consistent jumpshot , he can be a star in the league. He has the tools, but so far, I haven't seen any improvement in the jumpshot area. Still, at minimum, he's going to be a valuable player in the same vein as Bell is to the Warriors.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017
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  5. 206Fan

    206Fan Well-Known Member

    Looks like a good overall list. I really like Mikal Bridges, but I don't know that I'd like him for the Kings. He looks like he could be your 2nd best player, but as a complimentary piece. Kings would need to find the center piece before they start worrying about the other stuffs. I don't think Mikal is a SF at the NBA level. His frame is on the smaller end and he'd need to get a lot stronger to make up for it.

    Trae Young is a weird one for me. He needs to separate himself from other smaller PGs who have chucking tendencies. He's got great passing vision and high IQ, but I don't understand his shot selection one single bit. He deliberately calls for high screens because he wants to take a 30ft shot. I'm not in love with his overall quickness because I think he lacks a first-step. He doesn't get much burst out of it. I'd like to see 3 or 4 gears out of him. However, he makes it up by having great ball handling which helps him break down college defenses. I'm undecided with where to rank him. He's a fantastic college player, but can he carry it over to the NBA? I can't help but feel like he might be one of those players who needs 15-20 shots to get himself really going. His scoring reminds me way too much of Brandon Jennings. Maybe it's the Oklahoma coaches asking too much out of him? He's a great college player though. I don't enjoy watching his game(shot selection), but he's a joy for college fans.

    One name to keep an eye on is Arkansas' big man Daniel Gafford. 6'11 234lb freshman. He's a good, but not great athlete. Loads off of two feet(think of a more athletic Zach Collins). I think he could be a one and done candidate. Limited on offense, but he plays hard to get himself open. He's very mobile on defense and shows good shotblocking instincts. Good rebounder and tries to get low and box out opponents.
  6. SacTownKid

    SacTownKid Well-Known Member

    I like Jaren Jackson but I think the projects as more of a Taj Gibson type. Knox, Bridges, and Bamba have some bust potential but the boom is off the charts.
  7. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Watched a ton of games yesterday including the Kentucky/Virginia Tech game. A game that was a big step up for the Kentucky youngsters. Knox had an decent to good game. If you were to just look at the stats, he looked pretty good (21 pt's on 7 of 15 shooting and 2 of 5 from the three), but in fact, he still makes a lot of mistakes, and his rebounding is disappointing so far. But then, I still haven't figured out what he is. A SF or a PF, or is he another so called combo forward. Defensively, he's slow to react at times when switching, and also gets caught flat footed. All correctable, but I'm judging him on what he is right now, and explaining why I have him so low. His handles are adequate for the forward position, and he reacts to run outs fairly well, but for some reason, seems to always stop short of the basket and settle for a floater. He's a good athlete with good length, and nice form on his jumper. I'd like to see him take more three's, but acknowledge that Kentucky doesn't spread the floor very well which makes it difficult for him to get open as often as one would like. Jury is still out. He might be one of those players that really blossoms when he reaches the NBA.

    Also took in the Mich St. game. Can I watch one game when J. Jackson isn't in foul trouble. I swear, it seems that if he even breathes on an opposition player they blow the whistle. It's really hard to get a read on him when he sitting on the bench most of the time. However, he did manage to log 27 minutes in this game. What I do see I like, but it would also be nice to see him touch the ball every time down the floor. He may be, and probably is the most talented player on the Mich St. team, and he took a grand total of 6 shots, making 4 of them, and went 1 for 1 from the three. He definitely impacts the game defensively, blocking 4 shots and altering others. He has great defensive instincts and reacts quickly around the basket. He also grabbed 7 boards. Sometimes it appears that he's still trying to figure out how to fit in with the team offensively, but you get the feeling with him that what you see is just the tip of the iceberg. It wouldn't take much for me to move him up into my top four.

    Going back to the Kentucky game, don't fall asleep on Hamidou Diallo. He has really improved his outside shot, shooting 38.5% overall for the year. He's a freak athlete that looks like he figuring out how to play the game the right way. He can be a disruptive force on defense with his quickness. He had 3 steals yesterday and was all over the court harassing opposing players. Going on my gut here, but it tells me this guy could be really good at the next level.

    Took in the Arizona/New Mexico game, and Ayton had what is becoming a typical game for him. 14pts, on 7 of 9 shooting, he didn't attempt a three, 13 rebounds, and 2 blocks. he did nothing to take him out of my top three. Kid has a ton of upside and again, we could be seeing just the tip of the iceberg. The only thing that bothers me at times is that he seems to take plays off once in a while. He's been playing a lot of minutes, so it's possible that its nothing more than a conditioning problem. However, I'm nit picking. It's not enough to make an issue of. Have to mention Rawle Alkins in that game. He exploded for 26 pt's on 9 of 11 shooting and was 3 for 3 from the three. Dude is shooting 50% for the year from the three. He also had 5 boards, 2 assists and 1 steal.

    Of course I had to watch the Oklahoma game just to see Trae Young. He had another of his typical games, I almost laugh when I say that. 29 pt's on 9 of 22 shooting going 4 for 11 from the three. He also had 10 assists. It's really hard to explain Young. You can't just discard him as a chucker, because he makes passes at times that will blow your mind. If your one of his teammates, you had better have your eyes open at all times, because you never know when you'll be on the receiving end of a pass. Young has exceptional court vision, and seems to always have a plan when he drives into the lane. His plans don't always work out, but not always because of him. He reminds me a bit at times of J. Will with his unpredictability. If a coach could get a hold of him and install some discipline in him, He could turn out to be a star in the NBA. He definitely needs to get stronger, but he's listed at 6'2", so he's not that undersized, though he does have a thin frame. If you haven't seen him play, I suggest you take a look. You'll be shocked by some of his shots, and his passes, but if you look close enough, you can see a lot of talent there as well.
  8. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    I watched the Villanova game last wednesday. Villanova is a fun team to watch because they're so well coached. You could tape a game and use it as an instruction video on how to play basketball properly. It's for that reason that I have Villanova in my final four, and my favorite to win the whole banana. At least right now. Mikal Bridges didn't have one of his typical shooting games, scoring 7 pt's on 3 of 10 shooting and going 1 for 4 from the three. Most of his shots came up short, which makes me wonder if he doesn't have tired legs. Shooting aside (he's till shooting over 40% from the three) he's a wonder to watch on defense. In my opinion, he's the best overall defender in college basketball. He has a non stop motor on defense and his defensive BBIQ is off the charts. He's a rotation whiz with a great nose for the ball. Normally a good rebounder he only had 3 in this game.

    Offensively Bridges has improved from last season. Number one, his usage rate has increased. This season he's averaging 11.3 shots per game as opposed to last season's 6.8 attempts. He's also averaging 5.2 three pt attempts this season against last seasons 1.3 attempts. Overall, he's been far more aggressive on the offensive side of the ball, and one has to wonder if there's more there to be tapped. Last season when attacked by a close out, he would give up the ball. This season he's pump faking, putting the ball on the floor and attacking the basket. He is by the way, a very good finisher with good touch around the basket. For now, he's mostly a straight line driver, but with some work on his ballhandling, who knows? There are those that say they wouldn't take him that high because he'll never be a star in the league. There are those that said the same thing about some guy named Kawhi Leonard, to whom some scouts have compared Bridges. Star or not, I believe that he's a player that will impact the game one way or the other. He's a player that has improved every year in college, which bodes well for his future.

    Offensively he's been very efficient. He's averaging 17.1 ppg on just 11 shots per game. He's getting to the free throw line 3.2 times a game this season as opposed to 1.6 times a game last season He's a 6'7" player with close to a 7'2" wingspan, so he has terrific length. He's a very good athlete and good leaper, which he proved by hitting his head on the rim in the Gonzaga game. A game where he exloded for 28 pt's on 8 of 14 shooting overall and 5 of 9 from the three. More than anything, Bridges is a team first guy that will do anything that's asked of him to help the team win. He's an impact player on defense, and an improving player on offense. Three's a lot to like about him. If you took upside out of the picture, and I had to choose who I wanted on my team right now from a choice of Bagley, Ayton, Miles Bridges, Bamba or Sexton, I'd be hard pressed not to take Mikal Bridges. Of course some of those players are likely to end up being better than him. But you know what, I'm not sure of that.

    I'd be remiss if I didn't mention the freshman Omari Spellman, the 6'9", 245 lb PF from Villanova. This is a big man that can really shoot the three pointer. He's shooting 46.7% from the three overall this season, but is also quite capable in the post. He has a big frame and has trimmed off a lot of weight since arriving on campus. He's not afraid to bang with the big boys. He had 27 pts, going 4 for 7 from the three, while grabbing 8 boards. He's still a bit of a work in progress, but he's definitely someone to keep your eye on. Jay Wright is a terrific coach, and an excellent developer of players. Oh, and by the way, Jalen Brunson, the 6'2" PG for Villanova contributed 31 pts to the cause, going 6 for 10 from the three, and with 5 assists. Brunson is another one of those tough, hardnosed, feisty PG's that you love to watch play.

    If your going to beat Villanova, you probably need to catch them on a bad day. They're well coached, and they don't make mistakes. They can score from anywhere on the court, and they're one of the best defensive teams in college basketball. Good luck!
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  9. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    As a follow up to my Villanova post, I forget to mention one of their important bench players. Although he shows two previous years of stats, he's listed as a sophmore, so he must have gotten another year of eligibility due to injury. I'm speaking of Donte D'Vincenco a 6'5" SG. I think this kid could start for a lot of college teams. He's an excellent athlete with serious hops. He defends very well and is a very good outside shooter, averaging just under 40% from the three for the season. He has great handles and at times becomes the primary ball handler for the team off the bench. In the Temple game he ended up with 12 pts on 4 of 6 shooting overall and he went 2 for 4 from the three. He also had 4 assists and 1 steal. He doesn't get the press some of the others do, but he's an excellent player who I think has the tools to play in the NBA. My guess is he stays for another year at Villanova, and next season he gets his chance to shine.
  10. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Spent yesterday taking in a couple of current games, and then watching three games I hadn't gotten to yet with Texas. First, the Michigan St./Houston Baptist game. I was hoping for a foul free, many minute game for Jaren Jackson, but it was not to be. Once again he picked up some early fouls and sat, while his running mate, Miles Bridges ran over the opposition. Bridges had a very good game playing 29 minutes and scoring 33 pt's. He was very efficient, going 11 of 14 overall and 4 of 7 from the three. He also added 6 boards and 5 assists. I still haven't decided exactly what Bridges is, but you can't deny his results. One thing he is, is a terrific athlete and an aggressive one. Sometimes a bit too aggressive, but I'd rather have that than passive.

    Jackson, who didn't do much in the first half because he was saddled with fouls, and played most of the 2nd half with 4 fouls. He managed to hang in there until fouling out with about 7 or 8 minutes left to go in the game. While he only scored 4 pt's, all at the freethrow line, he really impacted the game in the 2nd half. He only played 18 minutes overall, but grabbed 8 boards and blocked 6 shots. It's frustrating to watch him play, because when he is on the floor, you can see the talent dripping off of him. He's a deceptive athlete who will look like he's floating out there, when suddenly he'll explode out of nowhere to block a shot or grab a rebound in a crowd. On one occasion when Houston had stolen the ball at halfcourt, and seemingly had an easy layup at the other end, he flew out of nowhere to block the shot from behind. He's an impressive player, who I wish the ref's would cut some slack. Hate to pick on them, but some of the calls on him are pure BS. Let the kid play for god's sake!

    I also took in the Arizona/N. Dakota St. game. It was a game that should have been a blow out, and was. I think Arizona ended up beating them by 30 pt's. Ayton had another in a series of good games, playing 26 minutes and scoring 25 pt's on 11 of 17 shooting. I think he only attempted one three point shot and missed. He also added 9 boards and 1 blk. I had him down for 2 blks, but apparently the official scorer didn't agree. Every time I see Ayton I'm amazed by how quick laterally he is. He really moves his feet well, and has the ability to come out and defend the pick and roll, something that Bamba can't do. More on that later. Ayton is the genuine deal. He's a big man that can shoot the ball (he's especially deadly from the top of the freethrow line. Almost automatic) all the way out to the three pt line, and he can score in the post, although he has some work to do in that area. He's even showed a baseline fall away jumper.

    Defensively he's a good man to man defender and can keep most players in front of him. He makes quick switches and is good at stopping the ball. Point is, I think he has very good defensive potential. He's not, and never will be the shotblocker that Bamba is, nor in all likelyhood, the shotblocker that Jaren Jackson will be, but there's more to defense than blocking shots, and he has very good awareness on D. I wouldn't be surprised to see Ayton be the number one pick in the draft depending on the needs of the team picking. I could see him fitting onto the Kings with Willie moving to the PF position. Not a desperate need for the Kings, but I could see him fitting in and making an impact. Just saying!

    Now to Bamba. I've watched him play in five games now and I can't sell myself on him. He can do two things, and one of them is hardly proven. One, he can shoot the three, or at least that's what they said coming into the season. Folks, he's shooting 17% from the three. Maybe he better not be shooting from out there. 2nd, he can block shots at a high rate. Well he's proven that he can. He's a shotblocking machine. However, in my humble opinion, he suffers from the Thabeet syndrome. He plants himself under the basket and hardly ever leaves there. I don't see him stepping out very often to defend on the perimeter. He doesn't appear to have good lateral quickness. He is a decent to good rebounder, but to be honest, with his length, he should be grabbing more. I question his hands. I've watched pass after pass go right through his hands. I've watched smaller players just take a rebound out of his hands. I've seen him get pushed around by smaller players.

    I know this sounds like a Bamba bash, but I just want you to know that yes, he has a lot of potential, but he's a long long way from achieving that potential. I hate to use the word raw, but he's extremely raw on the offensive side of the ball, and that's being kind. He has one thing he does well on offense, and that's dunk the ball. Other than that, he has no offense at all. He's entirely lost in a post up. He has no footwork, and no shot to go to, other than dunk the ball. I watched him shoot an air ball on a 12 foot baseline fadeaway, while being guarded by a 6'8" player. Dude, why are you shooting a fadeaway against a player a lot shorter than you? He has very little offensive awareness. There's no denying the overall potential, but his short term contributions to the team that drafts him will mostly be on the defensive side of the ball, and if he can't get out and defend the P&R, he'll be limited there as well. He's not in the same tier with the other top picks in my opinion.
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  11. Joshoua

    Joshoua Well-Known Member

    Ya I’m low on Bamba as well he isn’t touching Jackson as a prospect at all. We need a top 4 pick those 4 are difference makers
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  12. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Just finished watching another Texas game that I had recorded. He did get out on the perimeter and guard the pick and roll in this one. Still not sold on his ability out there though. What the Kings don't need is a long term project. Ayton is far more skilled than Bamba, he's shown so far to be a good pick and roll defender, and offensively, there's no comparison. I think he's the best big man in the draft. 2nd place is between Jaren Jackson and Bagley. Bagley is probably more diverse and has a non stop motor, but Jackson his definitely the better overall defender and shotblocker.. So pick your poison. Currently watching Oklahoma game with Trae Young. This kid is going to be a star. He can shoot and pass lights out, and he has no freaking fear.
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  13. 206Fan

    206Fan Well-Known Member

    If Young sustains this type of performance, do you think they take him with Fox already on the roster? Yeah we've seen a lot of 2-guard lineups, but they'd both automatically be defensive liabilities, and neither compliments eachother on offense.
  14. Sactown ExPat

    Sactown ExPat Active Member

    Young will end up in the 7-11 range with guys like the Bridgeses, Sexton, and Bamba. If the Kings are picking in that range they will just snag the top talent with the best attitude. Right now that would probably still be one of the Bridgeses at SF, which would fill a need. But there’s no telling come June, and I don’t they’ll care about current roster fit if they are drafting outside the top 5.
  15. OffTheWallJamal

    OffTheWallJamal Active Member

    Can't help myself, but Trae Young is giving me Curry vibes from his college days...
  16. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    You wouldn't be the first person to compare him to Curry. If he continues to play this way, and then manages to make a splash in the tournament, he could end up going top five. Still a long way to go, but he's impressive and only 19 years old.

    For those that didn't see the game, or don't know the result, Young went off tonight for 26 pts and get this, 22 assists. Just another day at work...... He's a fun player to watch.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2017
  17. OffTheWallJamal

    OffTheWallJamal Active Member

    That's the scary thing he is only 19 years old, he really reminds me of Junior college year Curry when he became really a point guard.

    Such an interesting prospect.
  18. Dime Dropper

    Dime Dropper Well-Known Member

    I've been on the Young bandwagon for a while now. It's very rare to see someone that young be so productive. He's crafty and an excellent passer, and he is dynamic and explosive as a scorer. If we didn't just draft Fox I would be posting a lot more about him. I still won't rule him out as our pick because he just looks really, really good. Not perfect, but very good.

    Doncic got ejected in the second quarter last night and was fired up. He had a bit of a tantrum going down the tunnel, kicking the walls a few times as he left. I don't mind that one bit. I actually liked seeing it as I had a slight worry that he might be too "nice." Glad to see he has that fire in him.
  19. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Here's a video of Young's last game. For those that think this kid is just a chucker, take a close look. If your on the Oklahoma team, and your open, Young will find you and get you the ball. When he drives the lane he always seems to have a purpose, not just hoping one will show up. He takes some ridiculous shots at times, but makes a lot of them. He's leading the nation in scoring, but he's also third in the nation in assists. That's a deadly combo folks...

    By the way, this game isn't an aberration, he does this every single game. Some question his athleticism, but he gets anywhere he wants on the floor anytime he wants. No doubt he needs to get stronger, but he doesn't shy away from contact. This kid is really really good...
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2017
  20. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    A few thoughts on Marvin Bagley. I've watched maybe 5 or 6 games with him so far with another one coming up today at 4 pm on ESPN2. After every game I'm left wondering the same thing. What exactly is he, in terms of position, and how does he fit into today's NBA? Duke has him playing the five and four postions, and almost strictly in the post. They do at times set him up in the high post, but even from there, because of his quickness, he mostly attacks the basket and seldom takes a jumpshot. I think he's taken somewhere around 25 to 30 three's all year and is shooting a slightly below decent 33% from there. However he's shooting a terrific 61.1% overall. He's a freak athlete, who can easily guard anyone from a center to a SG, and at times he's been successful guarding PG's. So defensively, he has no problem playing on the perimeter. Question is can he play offensively on the perimeter?

    Will he be nothing more than a taller version of Kenneth Faried, or will he be something closer to Anthony Davis? If a team is going to draft him in the top three, I'm sure they're hoping more for the latter than the former. How much of his ability is being hidden by Duke's system, or is what we see what we'll get? That's the question. There's no denying the results he's putting up, but in a league where teams want their big's to step out and play more on the perimeter, how does his current game fit? Personally I'm conflicted. I really, really like Bagley. I love his motor and the look in his eye when he's on the court. I'd feel more confident if his freethrow shooting percentage was higher. Free throw shooting is always a good indicator of a players shooting touch. For the most part, a player with a high freethrow percentage will usually end up being a good jumpshooter as well. 61% isn't terrible, but it's not great either.

    He is a terrific rebounder and that almost always translates to the next level. He's shown to be a willing and good defender. I doubt he'll be a great post defender at the next level when he'll go up against players as tall or taller and much stronger than him. For that reason I think in general his best position will be the PF position. He has pretty good handles and is also a good passer, so he's not without skills. He's really just a solid jumpshot away from being able to play the SF position. To be honest, if Bagley can eventually become a good outside shooter, he becomes almost unguardable. But that is a huge if, and that if is what decides whether he's a top three pick or not, in my humble opinion. I keep reminding myself that Calipari had Towns (and Cousins) stuck down in the low post at Kentucky, hiding the fact that he could play away from the basket. Is Bagley suffering the same fate?
  21. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Since the Kings do have a 2nd round pick in the coming draft, I thought I'd suggest a few players that they might consider. One would be Kevin Hervey a 6'9", 230 lb PF/SF. He actually projects to be a stretch forward in today's NBA. You probably haven't heard much about him because he plays in the Sun Belt conference for the University of Texas Arlington. He's an interesting player because of his background. As a sophmore in highschool, he was a 6'1" guard who spurted up to 6'7" for his junior year. Just prior to his senior year, he tore his right ACL but still managed to come back play impressively for the latter part of the year. Despite offers from a few major schools, he opted for Texas Arlington. After a so/so adjustment freshman year, he started to shine his sophmore year, when he tore his left ACL. (Harry Giles anyone) During his down time he grew from 6'7" to 6'9", and is currently have a very nice senior year, averaging 23.6 ppg while shooting 49.2% overall and 38% from the three. He's shooting 82.0% from the free throw line, which bodes well for his outside shot. He's also grabbing 8.9 rebounds a game and averaging 1.8 steals.

    He's proven to be a good defender and a very smart player. If he were a freshman putting up these numbers, and at a major school, he'd certainly be a first round pick, but he's likely to go somewhere in the 2nd round where I think he'd be a steal. I'd say to take in one of his games, but Texas Arlington isn't on national TV very much, so you'd need to keep your eye's open. In the meantime, here's a video of him.

  22. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Another kid I want to talk about is Chandler Hutchinson, a 6'7" SG/SF who plays for Boise St. He's another player likely to go in the 2nd round due to being a senior, and playing in a lesser conference. It's amazing how many of our top players played in lesser conferences. Curry, Lillard, McCollum etc, I won't bother to go through all of them. Hutchinson is an interesting player because of his athleticism and skill set. To be honest, I'm not sure what he is, or if it even matters in today's NBA. He's a very good athlete that can play above the rim. At the moment he's averaging 15.5 ppg in 28.1 minutes of play. Overall, his averages are down from his junior season, but it's still early and he may get them up by seasons end. Right now he's shooting 42.5% overall and only 30.3% from the three. However, he shot 40.7% from the three last season. His free throw percentage is 67.1%, which isn't horrible, but not great either. He also averages 8.5 rebounds a game and 1.1 steals.

    What makes him a little more unique is his passing ability. He's averaging 4.1 assists a game. Personally, I don't think his handles are good enough to be the primary ball handler, at least now right now, but it's nice to have a player with his passing ability. I have him projected as a SF, but he can likely play the SG position as well, ala Klay Thompson. Not sure he's as good a shooter as Klay was at the same point in time, but his shot does show promise. He's shown to be a willing and decent to good defender at the college level. He's fearless on offense, which is both a good, and bad thing. Good because he's not afraid to take the winning shot. Bad, because sometimes his decisions don't match his abilities. Here's a short video..

    After Hutchison's sophmore year, Boise St. decided to hire Phil Beckner to work with Hutchison in the offseason. Beckner is the same man that helped develop Damian Lillard. Beckner started by rebuilding Hutchinsons jump shot. He moved his release point higher and tightened up everything making for a quicker release. He also made him work hard on balance with the ball, footwork, and his ball handling. He couldn't leave the Gym every day until he had made 600 three's. Hutchison went from a no body to the best player on the Boise St. team.

    He also spent a lot of time in the weight room. When he arrived on campus he weighed 170 lbs. He now weighs 210 pounds. Hutchison is another of those players that may be taken in the 2nd round, but has first round talent.

    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  23. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Watched quite a few games today including the Oklahoma/Northwestern game. Northwestern isn't a good team and it ended up being a rout, but once again, Trae Young made a statement reinforcing the idea that he's the best PG in college. Just another day at work for him scoring 31 points on 9 of 16 shooting overall, and going 8 of 13 from the three. He also had 12 assists. Young is must see television. You never know what spectacular play he's going to pull off next. At one point they doubled him and appeared to have him trapped on the left side of the court a few feet across halfcourt. Somehow he managed to swing his right arm around one of the players and make a bullet pass to a teammate under the basket. The kid is nothing short of amazing. And yeah, he pulled up from 33 or 35 feet and let if fly, but it went in again, and again, and again!

    I'm reaching a point where I can't think of anything else to say about the kid. I can't remember the last time a college player was this consistently good game after game. I keep waiting for him to have an off night. So far it hasn't happened. He always looks like he's having fun out there, and he makes it look easy. I can't wait for his next game!
    kingsfan1984 likes this.
  24. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    I watched the Texas/Alabama game. It wasn't as good as I thought it might be with Bamba and Sexton both on the floor. Sexton's best weapon is attacking the basket, and Bamba's best talent is defending the basket. In this matchup, Bamba gets the nod. I think he ended up with 5 or 6 blocks, a couple of them against Sexton, 12 rebounds and around 18 pt's. That's a nice stat line, and I'm trying really really hard to like him. But I have to put everything within the context of, how what he does, translates to the NBA, and that's where he starts to lose me. Don't misunderstand me, I think he will be an NBA player, and probably a very good rim protector. I just wonder if he'll be just a one trick pony. Nothing wrong with that. Mutumbo made a nice living doing nothing but rim protecting, and DeAndre Jordon isn't doing to badly for himself either.

    So if that's what your looking for, then fine. I happen to be looking for more than that, especially if we end up drafting in the 5 or 6 spots. I would take Ayton over Bamba in a heartbeat. I think every single point that Bamba scored in the game was a dunk. Either on a put back, an alleyoop, or on a breakaway. I din't see one post move that I can remember. He took a couple of three's, but missed them both, one badly. I've heard some pundits and color analysts say that he can defend the post and the perimeter. I've seen him on the perimeter defending, I've seen him get beaten off the dribble out there many times. To his credit, he pursues well and sometimes is still able to affect the shot. But he doesn't have the lateral quickness of Ayton, or of a Willie Cauley-Stein. I think in the right system, in time, his perimeter defense will be fine. In short, I see a bright future for him on the defensive side of the ball. I don't see much on the offensive side of the ball. Maybe in time!

    I also question his hands. He fumbles a lot of passes, especially bullet passes, or quick short interior passes. He gets rebounds taken out of his hands by smaller players at times. He tends to wait for the ball to come to him instead of jumping for it, (probably a habit he picked up in highschool because of his length) and ends up getting out quicked by a shorter player. He still pulls down his lion share of boards, but I wonder how well he'll do in the NBA when he's up against bigger, stronger, more athletic players. Once again, maybe in time. If the Kings end up picking in the 8 to 12 range, I would have no problem taking Bamba. But above that, nope!
    kingsfan1984 likes this.
  25. kingsfan1984

    kingsfan1984 Well-Known Member

    Was Curry's passing and handling skills as good as Youngs at the same age? I'm starting to think that Young should be at the top of the Kings draft board regardless of fit. I like Fox, but Young is looking more and more like a true franchise possibly generational player ala Curry (maybe better?). Can't pass on him simply because of last years draft. Could make sense to trade maube Fox for Jackson with PHX and then kings select Young
  26. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    I don't remember Curry being as good a passer as Young at the same point in time. He certainly wasn't leading all of college in assists his freshman year. Other than assists, the rest of their stats are remarkably similar when comparing freshman years.

    Curry: 6'3", 185 lbs - 21.3 ppg - 53.6% fgp - 40.8% 3pp - 85.5% ftp - 2.8 apg - 1.8 spg.
    Young: 6'2", 180 lbs - 28.7 ppg - 48.5% fgp - 41.1% 3pp - 86.0% ftp - 10.4 apg - 1.8 spg.

    Of course this doesn't mean that Young will be as good, or a better player than Curry, but it does show that at this same point in time, he is probably a better all around player. What sets Young apart is his court vision and passing ability. His personal offense is very similar to Curry's. Some of the criticisms of Young, are the identical criticisms that Curry endured. Too weak! His body won't hold up to the rigors of the NBA. He'll be a liability on defense. His crazy shot selection won't fly in the NBA. His release is too low. Blah blah blah!. The truth is, we won't know until we know. Simplistic statement, but totally true. If we were producing robots, it would be a lot easier, but with human beings, you can't judge the desire of a player. You don't know what his work ethic will be once he has a huge paycheck in the bank. Great players tend to go to their own drummer.

    If I were a betting man, I'd certainly put my money on Young. I just like his on court attitude. He's unflappable, and I've yet to see a defensive scheme frustrate him. I've seen him make passes out of traps that are mind blowing, followed by that little smile on his face. He's loaded with confidence. Right now, Oklahoma looks like a lock for the tournament. If he can make a deep run in the tournament, we'll get a chance to see him go up against the best in college. Lets revisit him then.
    kingsfan1984 likes this.
  27. 206Fan

    206Fan Well-Known Member

    If the opportunity came for the Kings to trade Fox for another high level prospect while getting Young, I would definitely do it.

    However, one thing to keep in mind if we do draft Young is whether or not he'll get to play in a free-flowing offense like he is right now. Will Joerger put a tight leash on him like he has with Fox? Young needs to go to a team who's willing to give him the keys to the franchise. I don't think that would happen under Joerger.
  28. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    Look, I have no idea how Joerger would handle Young, but I'm not going to assume that he would waste Young's talent. Even in a more restricted offense, Young would still thrive. He's one of the most dangerous pick and roll players I've seen in a long time. He has such great court vision that when he turns the corner, you never know where the ball is going. He also has one of the best floaters I've ever seen. He's shooting 68% on his floaters. He's a extremely dangerous catch and shoot player. I can't remember him ever missing a catch and shoot shot this season in any game I've watched. His ability to come off a pick, catch the ball and square up as quickly as he does is amazing. If you go under a pick on him, he'll kill you. I don't think it would take Joerger long to figure out what Young is good at.
    kingsfan1984 likes this.
  29. bajaden

    bajaden Well-Known Member

    I took in the Villanova/DePaul game yesterday. I thought that DePaul might give Villanova a tussle, but it was not to be. Nova jumped on DePaul early and never took their foot off of DePaul's throat. Mikal Bridges had a very solid game as usual, flying all over the court on defense, and throwing in 20 pt's on 8 of 16 shooting overall and going 4 for 9 from the three. He also had 5 boards, 2 assists, 2 steals and 1 block. I doubt that Mikal will be a star, but I do think he could be one of the final pieces that makes a difference on a winning team. Of course I felt the same way about Kawhi Leonard, and he ended up becoming a star. I might add that Bridges has been compared to Leonard by some scouts.

    Once again I was impressed by Donte Divincenco the 6'4" backup PG/SG for Villanova. He has an NBA body, is an elite athlete, and knows how to play the game. He's a terrific defender and outstanding outside shooter. He's currently shooting 40.4% from the three, and 48% overall. In yesterday's game he had 11 pt's on 4 of 9 shooting, going 2 for 5 from the three. He also had 4 boards and 4 assists. He's plays both on and off the ball very well.
  30. 206Fan

    206Fan Well-Known Member

    I don't think Young is one of those guys who would do good on a low volume. I would be highly upset if any team that drafted him gave him less than 30mpg. If you want to see Oklahoma Young, then you need to give him the same type of environment. If you lower his usage and force him to play within a system that doesn't suit his strengths, he's not going to be the same player. In fact, he'll probably struggle. What makes him a top 10 prospect is the entire package. It's not just his playmaking or just his shooting. It's everything combined that makes him a special prospect worth a top pick.

    Fox is one of the quickest players in the NBA, but Joerger has no problem putting him in the league's 3rd slowest offense. o_O
    No safe bet that he would find ways to implement Young in PnRs. I mean.. he's had WCS(our best roll man) play in a Boris Diaw role.

    Still time left in the season, but it will be interesting to see how much room/patience Joerger is willing to give the young guys.

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